Tell the truth? Why would anyone want to do that?

People that are dishonest, corrupt, criminal, etc., often justify their flaws by suggesting that everyone’s a crook, it’s just that some (phony) people won’t admit it.  Obviously I don’t agree, but I seems possible that they are quite sincere in their cynicism.  The world really might look that way, through their eyes.

Of course Trump is a pathological liar, and now we have evidence that he sees himself as normal:

And his reason for largely ignoring the hate might be buried in yet another tweet attacking the New York Times:

screen-shot-2016-11-23-at-12-23-07-pm

In other words, Trump doesn’t seem to understand why you would “announce” negative or unpleasant truths about yourself.

It reminds me of economists who scratch their heads and wonder why people vote.  “After all, it’s not in their self interest.”

PS.  Complaints about my blogging (in the comment section) are now at an 8 year high.  Add some more below, if you wish.


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27 Responses to “Tell the truth? Why would anyone want to do that?”

  1. Gravatar of Christian List Christian List
    23. November 2016 at 09:48


    In other words, Trump doesn’t seem to understand why you would “announce” negative or unpleasant truths about yourself.

    I don’t think that’s the point Trump is getting at at all. As I see it Trump is making fun of the NYT by saying: You don’t need to announce what everybody is knowing anyhow.

    He also wants to inform his voters that even the NYT is now admitting that nobody likes (and reads) them anymore.

    These are the two points I see in his simple statement. Communication seems to be really difficult at times. We even see this simple statement of Trump in a very different way.

    I assume you need to be a master economist with an IQ of at least 160 to see what you see in this statement. I surely don’t see it.

  2. Gravatar of Below Potential Below Potential
    23. November 2016 at 09:52

    Here’s some positive feedback: your posts on economics are still among the very best, most interesting and most insightful out there.

  3. Gravatar of Kevin Erdmann Kevin Erdmann
    23. November 2016 at 09:54

    Yes. A few years ago I was defrauded when I sold my business by a guy who was very much like Trump. Even in the courtroom, in front of a jury, when we would catch him in lies, it seemed that he simply saw that as a tactical victory – he had won a tactical victory when he had cheated, and when we made his deceit clear to the jury, that was our tactical victory. Just two tactical moves with no moral difference. And he would stonewall the jury even when his deceit was obvious, because this was all just tactics.

    Very much like the stories you hear of Trump stiffing contractors. For my guy, breach of contract was just a tactic and my suing him to get paid was, similarly, just a tactic.

    By the way, the current American legal system operates very much to the benefit of sociopaths. People might argue in theory about anarcho-capitalism as some sort of utopian fantasy. But, for small businesspeople operating in contracts less than $250,000 or so, we already operate in a de facto anarchism. If someone defrauds you of $100,000 in white collar fraud, the criminal system won’t care and you’ll have to commit to a 6 figure lawsuit that will drag on for years to have a chance at justice. Then, if you when, collecting is on you.

  4. Gravatar of Below Potential Below Potential
    23. November 2016 at 10:05

    @Kevin Erdmann
    “People might argue in theory about anarcho-capitalism as some sort of utopian fantasy. But, for small businesspeople operating in contracts less than $250,000 or so, we already operate in a de facto anarchism. If someone defrauds you of $100,000 in white collar fraud, the criminal system won’t care and you’ll have to commit to a 6 figure lawsuit that will drag on for years to have a chance at justice. Then, if you when, collecting is on you.”

    Anarcho-Capitalism has nothing to do with lawlessness. Instead, it means the absence of a regional monopoly with respect to the production of legal rules.
    There are good arguments that people like you would be much better protected under a system of Anarcho-Capitalism than today (see, e.g., https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmXDrm5Q-eQ)

  5. Gravatar of Kevin Erdmann Kevin Erdmann
    23. November 2016 at 10:06

    edit: “if you win”

  6. Gravatar of Kevin Erdmann Kevin Erdmann
    23. November 2016 at 10:07

    Below potential:

    I wasn’t clear. I basically agree with you. Now we have pretend law, which is like all the bad parts of anarchy and none of the potential good parts.

  7. Gravatar of bill bill
    23. November 2016 at 10:17

    @Kevin Erdmann: You are exactly right. And $100,000 is the threshold if there are absolutely no ambiguities. I’ve found a couple of distressing cases in my years in business. But much more frequently, it was nice to know that most people I dealt with just did the right thing because that’s what most people do. I really found a high degree of trust with my vendors, clients, partners and lenders. I’ve never been to court, thankfully.

    Regarding Trump: Seeing a couple of his latest flip flops (in which I also place no confidence), I’ve concluded that we will learn what it is like to be ruled by a Magic 8 Ball. Albeit a Magic 8 Ball with tons of conflicts of interest who really will be a decabillionaire by the end of his term.

  8. Gravatar of ssumner ssumner
    23. November 2016 at 11:18

    Christian, I hope you are joking. Or is English not your first language?

    Thanks Below.

    Kevin. I totally agree about our legal system. I know small businessmen who have been dragged through that nightmare.

    Trump used to avoid paying his suppliers, knowing they would have trouble suing.

  9. Gravatar of Vladimir Vladimir
    23. November 2016 at 11:43

    I wish there was a more general way of explaining this mindset than just corrupt/criminal because I see it in nice people too who think that eg. Russia and the USA are exactly the same in their self interested intentions and how they lie to the public. They don’t even try to see the difference between trying to tell the truth and just being uniformed, vs specifically trying to lie to sell an obviously fake story.

    I notice this mindset in eastern european people a lot, and also a lot of foreign policy realists (even though I would consider myself more of a realist). It’s like they can’t grasp the actual reality that most neocons really do just want to make the world a better place even at a cost to their home country.

  10. Gravatar of Scott Freelander Scott Freelander
    23. November 2016 at 11:46

    Good post.

  11. Gravatar of Jeff Jeff
    23. November 2016 at 11:48

    This has been going on for a while. My brother, a CPA, worked for several small construction firms in 1980’s and 90’s in Southern California. It was common practice for general contractors to find or make up excuses not to pay their suppliers and subcontractors, to the point where many suppliers and subs would work only for cash, and I mean currency, in advance.

    You would think there is an opportunity here for vertical integration to obviate the agency problems, but it doesn’t seem to happen.

  12. Gravatar of AL AL
    23. November 2016 at 12:01

    Scott I don’t really read your posts but I’m sure they’re fine. My beef is with your refusal to respond to my comments. For God’s sake, man, I’m the only normal, non-ideological human who comes within miles of this place. I insist you start responding to my pithy and often deceptively-multilayered observations!

    PS: is there some sort of decoder ring I need to read this blog?

    PPS: mine seems to have gotten lost in the mail ???

  13. Gravatar of Christian List Christian List
    23. November 2016 at 13:15

    Okay you are right again. It was my mistake. I didn’t see the link to Vox as well. It’s seems to be part of his persuasion ideology (and pathological personality). He would never admit weakness or wrongdoings, so he really doesn’t seem to understand why you would announce something like this about your company. But I’m glad that you thought English was my first language. I take this as a compliment.

    You also implied in another post that there might be four years of Trump (if I remember correctly). For me it’s hard to see at the moment how he can survive until the midterm elections. He’s not even President yet but every little tiny step of him is watched and commented on excessively. The media outlets hate him more than ever, not to mention the Democrats and even members of his own party will block him (just think of the Senate). That’s exactly what I predicted months ago: The separations of powers is very strong in America. Too strong for my taste but that’s another topic.

  14. Gravatar of Tom Brown Tom Brown
    23. November 2016 at 13:38

    Perhaps Trump isn’t Hitler 2.0, but rather Mobutu 2.0: his government will be not just a kakistocracy (or kakocracy), but a kleptokakocracy.

  15. Gravatar of Dan W. Dan W.
    23. November 2016 at 14:18

    If you did not know the president but knew who had been named so far to his cabinet I would assume Ted Cruz was the president elect. IOW, I don’t think there is any despair yet from conservatives.

  16. Gravatar of Lorenzo from Oz Lorenzo from Oz
    23. November 2016 at 14:52

    The state, as legal monopolist, under-provides its service. Well, I’m shocked.

    Putting on my medievalist hat, folk forget that, when the common law developed, every village (of about 300-500 people) essentially had its own manorial court. The common law was the king’s offering over the top of that. (The only part of the Magna Carta which called for more government was folk wanted more royal judges visiting locally more often.)

    Expansion of legally recognised adjudication services might help fix this clear government failure.

  17. Gravatar of ssumner ssumner
    23. November 2016 at 15:36

    Vladimir, You said:

    “because I see it in nice people too who think that eg. Russia and the USA are exactly the same in their self interested intentions and how they lie to the public.”

    Yes, this is why nice people are often easily conned.

    Jeff, Good point.

    AL, You asked:

    “is there some sort of decoder ring I need to read this blog?”

    Oh you can read it without the decoder ring. But people like Christian List (who lacks the decoder ring) don’t get any of the esoteric meanings that are embedded in the Kabbalah.

    Christian, You said:

    “He’s not even President yet but every little tiny step of him is watched and commented on excessively.”

    Here I’ll cut you slack. In a perfect world, or in Europe, we’d get rid of our bad leaders quickly. Here a President can survive almost anything. Herbert Hoover survived 4 years of the Great Depression. He’ll probably survive.

    Tom, I had no idea how Trump would govern, other than that he’d break lots of promises (partly because many were contradictory, so he couldn’t possibly have kept them all.) I also saw he had a cavalier disregard for the truth. The actual Trump may be boring, which of course would be really good. But my number one objection is still there—I don’t trust him in an international crisis, and now I don’t trust the foreign policy team he’s putting together (other than the UN ambassador pick)

    Dan, Cruz is more of a libertarian, but I see your point.

  18. Gravatar of Major.Freedom Major.Freedom
    23. November 2016 at 16:50

    Sumner, you refusing to engage my ideas and my arguments is just as bad as Trump not publishing self-incriminating thoughts from his critics.

    You do not have the moral high ground vis a vis Trump. You both have rather intellectually cowardly practices.

  19. Gravatar of Tom Brown Tom Brown
    23. November 2016 at 16:55

    The actual Trump may be boring, which of course would be really good.

    I agree. That’s why I always say I’d like campaigns to have the look and feel of engineering preliminary design reviews for a new micro-controller (or the equivalent). Only those of us who could stay awake will actually remember to or be inspired to vote. The more boring the better. Same goes for governing.

    I don’t think Trump is very ideological (a good thing in this case), but I worry he’ll grow interested in using his power to gather more power and to enrich himself and his family (and smite his enemies?). I think we can survive the graft and corruption, but I hate the idea of him becoming interested. I’d prefer he just get bored and resign to do something more befitting of his splendiferous grandeur: like run another beauty pageant or something (Miss Multiverse?).

  20. Gravatar of Jerry Brown Jerry Brown
    23. November 2016 at 19:50

    Just want to say Thanks! for your blogging even if I disagree occasionally. Its always interesting and no complaints here.

  21. Gravatar of Ddawg Ddawg
    24. November 2016 at 08:00

    Any thoughts on Trump’s voucher idea?

  22. Gravatar of ssumner ssumner
    24. November 2016 at 08:20

    Thanks Jerry.

    Ddawg, Haven’t seen the details, but I’m a big fan of vouchers. I’d prefer they be universal, and that we abolish government schools entirely. Separate church and state, and also separate education and state.

  23. Gravatar of Massimo Heitor Massimo Heitor
    24. November 2016 at 09:58

    This post is unhinged.

    Normal behavior is to loudly tout positives and downplay negatives. That isn’t even considered dishonest. Colleges feature smiling happy successful students on promotional materials. They do not feature failing students, ugly students, obnoxious students, or students with various mental and emotional problems which are all realities you can discover for yourself. This isn’t an accurate portrayal it’s totally manipulative in a basic common way. Our society works like that.

    While I respect Scott Sumner and similar figures like David Frum, they periodically write stuff that is so outrageously unreasonable and biased to make Trump look bad that it makes me skeptical of their general anti-Trump stance. This restores my faith in people like Peter Thiel, Victor Davis Hanson, Larry Kudlow and other respectable types who’ve strongly advocated that a Trump presidency is a good reasonable choice for even the most principled conservatives.

  24. Gravatar of Kevin Erdmann Kevin Erdmann
    24. November 2016 at 12:57

    Bill, that was my experience too. This country works so well because it’s full of people who generally want to be lovely, as Russ Roberts would say. Something we can be thankful for, for sure.

  25. Gravatar of Christian List Christian List
    24. November 2016 at 14:06

    Well Massimo got a point. It’s standard (American) behaviour to loudly tout positives and to downplay negatives.

    It’s not perfectly clear why the NYT is doing this. Do they really care about this deeply or do they only pretend? Their announcement looks like simple signalling to me. They want to signal: “We heard you, we care”. – But do they really care? You can’t tell.

  26. Gravatar of ssumner ssumner
    25. November 2016 at 07:28

    Massimo, You said:

    “Normal behavior is to loudly tout positives and downplay negatives.”

    That tells me a lot about your character.

  27. Gravatar of Major.Freedom Major.Freedom
    3. December 2016 at 16:08

    What tells me a lot about the “character” if this blog’s author is his professed strategy of purposefully lying to the readers “for the greater good”, and, self-contradictorily, the professed philosophy that truth cannot even be known, that what he wants his readers to believe to be truth is merely “what most people believe”, or “what he can get away with saying” to benefit his own personal agenda. In other words, readers are to cast permanent doubt on what they think, and to instead believe on faith what Sumner tells them.

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